Monday, May 31, 2010 - 8:16 AM

While we don't yet know all the facts, the apparent killing of at least 10 people aboard a ship bound for Gaza with humanitarian aid already has all the hallmarks of a massive public-relations disaster.
It does sound like there might have been some kind of violent response from the activists on the boat, and the Israeli military is claiming its forces encountered “live fire and light weaponry including knives and clubs."
But the international response has been swift. Turkey has recalled its ambassador and warned of "consequences," U.N. Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon has called for an investigation, European governments have expressed shock, and I imagine thousands of outside observers like me are wondering just what possessed the Israeli government to risk such an outcome when it sent naval commandoes to board the vessel.
As Haaretz's Amos Harel puts it, "The damage that Israel has caused itself internationally can hardly be exaggerated." Harel warns that the rumored presence of an Israeli Arab activist among the victims could lead to riots and perhaps even "a third intifada."
Another liberal Haaretz commentator, Bradley Burston, comments, "We are no longer defending Israel. We are now defending the siege. The siege itself is becoming Israel's Vietnam."
Israeli officials appear to be circling the wagons; the question now becomes what the White House will say and do. So far the Obama administration has said little, but with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu currently in Canada and scheduled to visit Washington Tuesday, it can't stay silent for long. There is talk in Israel that Netanyahu will cancel his trip, which would probably be the smart thing to do. There will be heavy international pressure on Obama to condemn the incident, and he will probably make some kind of mild statement. But a White House visit would quickly make the United States the focal point of world attention in a way that is, as White House officials like to put it, "not helpful."
It already has the makings of a huge international fracas that will make the Goldstone Report look like small potatoes by comparison. But to what end? Israelis on the right end of the political spectrum -- and that is most of them these days -- are convinced there is a "propaganda war" against their country, that most if not all of the criticism is unfair, and that the real issue is the radicalism of groups like Hamas and Hezbollah, which openly call for Israel's destruction. That's certainly the perspective of hard-line government officials like Deputy Foreign Minister Daniel Ayalon, who has already called the ships an "armada of hate and violence" and accused the activists of links to al Qaeda.
In other words, there's a huge unwillingness on the Israeli right to face reality -- that Israel is fast losing friends and allies in the world, and that this government in Jerusalem has only accelerated the shift. It's not hard to imagine boycott campaigns gaining momentum, damaging the Israeli economy and isolating the country diplomatically, especially in Europe.
The one thing that might extrictate Israel from this mess is a violent response from the Palestinian side -- which never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity. Stay tuned.
I wonder what would have been the reaction of the European governments if a flotilla had violated their territorial waters, despite early warnings that any such attempts would be considered as a hostile action.
If the mission had really been humanitarian in nature, there would have been an innumerable number of other ways to dispatch the aid.
Of course the Western media assumes that Israeli commandos fired first without provocation, since they're inherently evil and irrational.
Yes, 'flotilla on territorial waters'?
It was on International waters you dimwit, Israel once again has proved it thinks it can defy international law. It backfired, and now Israel will pay.
Those ships carried nothing but humanitarian aid, its been cleared from customs of 4 different nations, and broke no international law.
There are no other ways to dispatch aid, ignorance is bliss for the one who states that.
Israeli commandos attack an aid ship, on international waters, and expect rose petals laid out for them?
Then they open fire first, and murderer innocent civilians.
the key word is territorial waters
the water outside Gaza is not Israels and the assault took place in international waters, this is called piracy. What ever happen on that ship Israel was the aggressor, and few could have done this without Turkey declaring war and calling in Nato
since this happened in international waters, not territorial waters, I wonder what you are talking about?
'I wonder what would have been the reaction of the European governments if a flotilla had violated their territorial waters
This flotilla is a mockery of human rights. If aid to Palestinians was its true intent, it would have taken the options offered by Israel to deliver that aid. This was pure and simple an act of incitement intended to dupe folks, many of whom write on this blog, into viewing Israel as the guilty party. Israel's enemies have learned they cannot defeat her militarily. Rather, they have embarked on a media battle intended to brand Israel as a violator of human rights and weaken her standing in the international community.
There would be no blockade of Gaza were the terrorist organization Hamas to end its vow to destroy Israel and enter into peace negotiations. Palestinians in the Gaza do indeed live a miserable existence, but it is a direct result of their terrorist leaders. Put the responsibility to for this incident where it belongs - on the Hamas and its sympathizers.
Let's see, when the UK was in the middle of the Northern Ireland issues (which were killing many more Britons than Israelis are being killed now) the US responded to this by placing an arms embargo on Northern Irish government forces. The US also invaded a sovereign territory of HM, Grenada, without even telling us first. And yet the response was peaceful, no? Or perhaps a better equivalent is when British soldiers occasionally strayed into Ireland during the Troubles, I bet the Irish quickly responded with commandos... Or not.
The entire idea that any European government would react with a commando raid to a blockade-busting flotilla is ridiculous. The idea that any other government would is equally ridiculous - they either lack the capability or, generally, retain the common sense not to kill people who are quite evidently not a major threat.
Without being sarcastic, the nearest comparison is the Cod Wars, when the worst the action got was tangling the props. Even if Israel was so desperate to block the ships, it would have been easy enough (compared to the raid) to tangle the propellers and then deal with the ships.
But sir they did not violated any territorial waters. Like the USS Liberty they were in international waters and attacked by people who had not right to do what they did. It was reported they found slingshots on board. What is happening the outcome of the 1967 war and the people who started that war are not watching the lose of what looked like an easy victory. This is not going to pass. This is the day that justice came to the pirates.
Remember the 34 murdered on the USS LIberty and the 130 serious wounded when the USA Government abandoned our service men to armed thugs much like the thugs who attacked the boats last night.
I see where you are coming from. However, Israel is also playing right into their hands by being both secretive and aggressive. After all...
1. It took place in international waters.
2. The issue is that Gaza has been under blockade for 3 years! How is this not a violation of Human Rights in any way. Its well documented that while the blockade was set up to deny weapons, it has denied almost everything but bare sustenance for the people of the Gaza Strip.
Whatever way you look at it, it was certainly attempted as propaganda for anti-Israeli groups. And Israel played so well, you woul think that had a copy of the script and were playing a paid part.
Here is how Israel should have played it:
Attempt a peaceful boarding with plenty of multi-national press coverage (no one would have said no). make sure the flotilla knew that they were on the international stage. That way, if any sort of live fire broke out, Israel could prove that it was the one taking it rather than giving at the beginning. Finally, once said boarding proceeded peacefully and the cargo confirmed as humanitarian aid, escort the ships into Gaza.
If Israel has done that instead, they would be hailed as turning the corner on the Middle East Peace Process (or some such heroic title) and the propaganda that you were so quick to condemn would never have occured.
So, yes, it was designed as propaganda, but who made sure it played out exactly the way they wanted it? There is only one country that had the opportunity to change it around.
Israeli apologists are so hot to defend the latest Israeli war crime that they don't even pay attention to the facts. Fact: the flotilla was in international waters, not violating Israel's territory. Fact: Israel has no territorial waters, since it refuses to declare boundaries. Fact: Israel had no right to give anyone early warnings, since the flotilla was heading for Gaza, and Israel does not own Gaza--how would you like it if they tried to stop you from going to Canada? Fact: DUH! Gaza is blockaded--there are no other ways to dispense the aid, which is what this whole thing was about. Fact: Israeli commandos began firing from ships and helicopters before they boarded the flotilla, which means they were not under attack. But you are right about one thing: they are inherently evil and irrational.
I wonder what would have been the reaction of western governments if the Iranians had killed the British Sailors that they said had violated their waters some time ago despite warnings that any such attempts would be considered as a hostile action.
If this mission had really been to stop the flotilla without any loss of life, there were innumerable other ways to accomplish that.
Of course the Israeli Military and Government officials assume that the passengers on the boat fired first without provocation, since they're inherently evil and irrational.
It goes both ways. Instead of blindly parroting the Israeli Governments position Matt, one should ask.. what is god’s name were the Israelis thinking? Even the Iranians are intelligent enough to understand that the blowback from killing civilians in such an action would not be worth it. They acted more like the North Koreans in this case,....doing whatever they wish and risking the lives of others at the same time .
This sounds like very poor execution of a risky and poorly thought out plan. This plays right into the hands of Hamas and serves to once again demonstrate to the Arab street that the Israeli leadership is just as morally bankrupt as Arab leadership is.
This is also another screw up by Bibi. Any dummy can kill a man. It take intelligence and planning to handle such situations without risking the lives of everyone. It is embarrassing. Israel deserves better. Bibi can’t get anything right can he? He upsets his best ally. now the rest of the west. He has always been arrogant and will forever be executing poorly thought out plans. Not half the man his brother was.
You're an idiot with selective "outrage". The U.S. (excluding Obamatrons like you) has ONE ally in the Islamic sea aka the Middle East - Israel.
Clear thinking people understand the BIG picture, Hamas and Hizballah (are you a member?) are trying to ELIMINATE Israel.
People like me WON'T let that happen
I wonder what would have been the reaction of the European governments if a flotilla had violated their territorial waters, despite early warnings that any such attempts would be considered as a hostile action.
If the mission had really been humanitarian in nature, there would have been an innumerable number of other ways to dispatch the aid.
Of course the Western media assumes that Israeli commandos fired first without provocation, since they're inherently evil and irrational.
Bibi is a disaster for all concerned
Both sides will be so busy spinning the story that it will be very difficult to establish just what happened. One thing is clear to me, and that is when the Israelis elected Bibi, the heavy hand that has led to PR disasters for Israel became inevitable. Bibi has no empathy at all for Arabs, and no respect for his allies, and this inevitably leads to thuggish behavior which alienates everyone except for the Israeli right wing.
Wrong not just once, but twice.
First, the ship was in international waters. That's factual error number one, but it's a small matter, because the ships were unarmed, bringing humanitarian aid to a people under illegal military embargo by an international criminal enterprise.
Then too, had the aid flotilla reached the vicinity of Gaza, THEY STILL WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN IN ZIONIST TERRITORIAL WATERS. GAZA DOES NOT BELONG TO THE ZIONIST CRIMINALS, NOR THE WATERS OFF GAZA, (NOR THE SUBSTANTIAL GAS DEPOSITS BENEATH THOSE WATERS -- though maybe that's a story for another day.)
I must confess to a deep curiosity as to just what it will take for the international community to say, "That's it. That's enough." The Israelis for their part seem almost breathtakingly blind -- indifferent even -- to any notion of consequences, seemingly eager to "go there". Is there a "there" there?, or is what seems homicidal(suicidal?) arrogance actually a new paradigm where Israel does whatever to whomever and there are never any consequences? History says otherwise. Five thousand years of Jewish history repeatedly says otherwise. Can you spell T-H-E N-E-X-T H-O-L-O-C-A-U-S-T?
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We often hear the phrase "Israel's right to exist" and along with it, "Israels' right to self-defense." Notwithstanding the faux-legitimacy given these concepts by decades of repetition, there is another, truth-based, ethics-based point of view.
In 1917, the British imperial executive (the Foreign Office) and the World Zionist Organization colluded in a criminal conspiracy to steal Palestine from the 95% Arab population who had lived there for 70 generations, and to give it to the Jews/Zionists. This "plan" was a crime then, as it is a crime now. A crime is still a crime, despite control and censorship of the media. A crime is still a crime despite 90 years of impunity from prosecution or 90 years of propaganda. NO AMOUNT OF TIME CAN CHANGE A LIE INTO THE TRUTH; NO AMOUNT TIME CAN CONVERT A CRIME INTO A LEGAL ACT.
The Zionist entity called Israel is nothing less than a geopolitical
crime-in-progress. This is reality. This is fact.
So when next you hear about Israel's "right to exist", consider: no crime has a "right to exist", no criminal enterprise has a "right to exist". Correspondingly, no criminal has a "right to self-defense". No criminal has a right to commit violence in the furtherance of a crime. No criminal has the right to fight back against the lawful authority that arrives to halt the crime and arrest the criminals.
Israel, the Zionists, their enablers, and their supporters are criminals: thieves and murderers on a global scale. They have no "right to exist" (as criminals) and they have no "right to self-defense" as they commit their crimes.
But they do have rights. They have the right to surrender to a competent authority. The right to a fair trial. If found guilty, the right to a proportionate penalty. And once the offending parties have "done their time", the right to rejoin society and resume a peaceful cooperative existence.
Well Matt, it was not an European reaction. It was Israeli. Address that issue and stop trying to make excuses.
The Jeff. Davis post sums up the core of the conflict between Israel and her enemies. It is the total lack of tolerance for Jewish sovereignty that fuels these flames. The Jewish people have as much right to sovereignty on that land as do the Arabs. Get rid of Israel and where will the caliiphate expand to next, Spain, Europe Ameria? The Gaza flotilla exploited human rights today to further their political agenda. There is no shortage of food or medical supplies in Gaza. Rather, it is the continued incitement against Israel that is the real goal of these tactics.
Its easy to be an armchair quarterback and discuss what Israel could have done differently. Putting the focus on Israel is a diversion from the real problem. HAMAS. It is the policies/ideology like those of the Hamas that are the root cause of the conflict and the violence today. There would be no embargo on Gaza but for the fact that the Hamas uses whatever it can import to increase its arsenal and attack Israel. Hamas cares less about its people than the rest of the world. It is Hamas who puts the Palestinians at risk by rocket fire against Israel. Hamas could easily have ended this embargo by giving to the Jewish people what it demands for itself - recognition and self determiniation. But it won't. Until the international community recognizes the supremist ideology of Hamas and its cronies, as the evil in this conflict, we will continue to blame and weaken the wrong party - Israel. Shame on us!
@Donna2. Tell a lie big enough and often enough and the people will believe you. This flotilla was not about humanitarian aid - nor was there any massacre. This flotilla provoked conflict and it got what it asked for.
Israel is the United States only ally in the middle east. This has been made possible by immense amounts of military and non-military aid given to Israel by the US. Actually around $19,000,000,000 in military aid alone (that we know of) between 01 and 07. That's a lot of dough. The truth is that without this aid which has been ongoing for decades, there would be no state of Israel. Its enemies would have consumed it long ago.
The truth is, the oil in the region is the US "interest". Israel's well being exists only as long as the US needs a foothold to secure physical access to that resource.
It was international waterspace...
You know, there is no solution unless there arises a Palestinian Martin Luther King, and I hope the Palestinians realize this and resist the temptation to respond violently.
Weighing all the events of the past fifty year history of Israeli/Palestinian relations, I can honestly say I no longer support the Israelis. Just don't believe them anymore. I think the turning point for me was when I watched a group of young Israelis drinking and having a party while watching the phosphorus bombs falling on the Gaza strip. Jewish exceptionalism suddenly became for me a syrup of ipecac.
an answer to everyone who keeps saying international waters
Any state, in a time of conflict, can impose an embargo, and while it cannot carry out embargo activities in the territorial waters of a third party, it can carry out embargo activities in international waters. This is international maritime law.
Within this framework it is legal to detain a civilian vessel trying to break an embargo and if in the course of detaining the vessel, force is used against the forces carrying out the detention then that force has every right to act in self defense
International laws allow to attack any ship trying to breach a blockade, even in international waters:
San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea, 12 June 1994:
67. Merchant vessels flying the flag of neutral States may not be attacked unless they:
(a) are believed on reasonable grounds to be carrying contraband or breaching a blockade, and after prior warning they intentionally and clearly refuse to stop, or intentionally and clearly resist visit, search or capture;
as for soldeirs opening fire first your simply wrong. The videos clearly show the activists going nuts, attacking the soldiers with rods and knives and throwing them overboard. In fact if you were right then why did 5 of the boats have zero problems
Trolls are out in force today!
So other (unpunished) international crimes justify Israeli actions to commit similar crimes?
The Israeli siege of Gaza is illegal. Israel has no rights to stop any ship from reaching Gaza.
The ship was heading to Gaza, not Israel.
If a ship was travelling to Germany, how can France stop the ship?
The boats were on international waters, not Israeli waters so attacking is called piracy.
Why are people so ill informed?
The massacre occurred in international waters.
There was no violation of "territorial waters." Israel boarded the aid ship illegally in international waters. They can hardly be surprised that the protestors responded defensively.
Also, there are no other ways to dispatch the aid to civilians in Gaza. It's under blockade or haven't you heard? Israel has refused to allow any aid into the region, whether it is medical, monetary or building supplies to help people through the winter. The paltry amounts that they do claim to bring in are less than a quarter of what the UN has estimated is needed per day.
Israeli commandos most likely did fire first. The activists didn't have guns to fire with, as far as I've heard. Sticks, knives and other assorted weapons, most probably. But if you break into my house and come in uninvited, I'm picking up whatever I've got and I'll use it in any way I can to get you out before you hurt me and mine.
Civil Disobedience and Non violent Resistance
Human rights activist often engage in civil disobedience in order to bring attention to their causes. The activist on the flotilla were little different from blacks who sat down at whites only lunch counters knowing full well the white authorities would soon come to penalize them. Israel is not simply trying to stop weapons, they are effectively starving 1.5 million Gazans into submission. Hamas should not be the issue. We should focus the civilians welfare.
It does not matter who is leading that massive refugee camp which more resembles an open air prison. Collective punishment is a violation of human rights and against UN conventions. No matter how you swing it the blockade is wrong, and activist are right to demonstrate their contempt through civil disobedience.
Several of you have made the false assertion that Israel is the United States ONLY ally in the Middle East. This is a ridiculous argument with no basis in fact. Let me educate you.
1. EGYPT: From the Camp David peace accords in 1978 until 2000 (the latest year for which figures are available), the United States has subsidized Egypt's armed forces with over $38 billion worth of aid. Egypt receives about $2 billion annually--$1.3 billion in foreign military financing and about $815 million in economic support fund assistance --making it the second largest regular recipient of conventional U.S. military and economic aid, after Israel.
2. SAUDI ARABIA: Saudi Arabia is America’s top customer. Since 1990, the U.S. government, through the Pentagon’s arms export program, has arranged for the delivery of more than $39.6 billion in foreign military sales
3. JORDAN: U.S. has provided billion in military aid, conducts training and intelligence sharing.
4. TURKEY: A member of NATO, Turkey is one of the U.S.'s strongest ally allowing for U.S. bases necessary for wars in Afghanistan and Iraq.
5. Kuwait: Maintains U.S. bases, U.S. fought to liberate from Iraq. Kuwait receives significant trainng and support from U.S. MIlitary.
Please read: http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/mideast/RL32260.pdf
The list goes on and on.
IN FACT, when you evaluate the situation you find that Israel provides none of the benefits of an allegiance that the U.S.'s alliances with Muslim-Arab countries. The united states is not permitted to have bases in Israel, Israel has no economic benefit to provide the United States and provides no significant strategic advantage whatsoever. Furthermore:
1. Israel spies on the United States more than any other "ally" it operates an agressive espionage program against the United States...hardly the behavior of an ally.
2. Israel sunk an American warship during the six day war.
3. Israel's Mossad targeted U.S. diplomats during the Lavon Affair (look it up) planning ot assassinate U.S. diplomats and then blame it on Palestininans. (true story look it up)
So here we have a country that spies on America, has attacked Americans in the past and afford the United States no tangible strategic benefit and my questions is Why are we allies?
Seriously, I would welcome anyone who could explain to me why the U.S. is allies with Israel? What does this alliance provide us?
1. Israel
Give the aid to Israel to dispatch
Yeah right, This is the country that is imposing the blockade and we are supposed to trust them to distribute the aid
Don't try to defend this action it just makes you look stupid
Israeli cycling between aggression and being a victim
Your comments are a neat sandbox illustration of how nations (and persons) tend to cycle between aggression (on the one hand) and being a victim (on the other) in order to avoid change when change is warranted and important. Overstating the matter (" . . . since they're inherently evil and irrational") comes off as a passive-aggressive way to shift the terms of discourse away from aggression gone awry to how Western media reactively functions as uncritical critics.
The mission really was humanitarian in nature. Why the "if"?
And who gave Israel the right to decide how humanitarian aid goes to people in need?
Q-How can Israeli raid that killed more than 10 people, and injured 30,in the international waters, on the ships that are bound to Ghaza for humanitarian mission, and get a way with it?
A-Under pressure from Obama Administration, the UN statement did not exclusively condemned Israel, which contends that its soldiers were acting in self defense after being attacked by the civilians aboard the ship.
That's how Israel gets a way with murder in Ghaza everyday, because The United States of America always cover for them. The whole world including the Arab world see the Israeli's atrocity on TV, but Israel has nothing wrong by attacking the Turkish Ships on International Waters, and put the passengers in prison, and nobody wiil do anything about it, and the media will forget it in a day or two, also.
Actions like these from The Isaraeli government, and protection from The US, will fuel all those muslim fanatics in the world to react against Israel and the US, in the future.
silly, hysterical ans uninteresting.
obviously another Netanyahu attack dog, except this one has gone cyber.
Palestinians have the right to choose their own leadership- that is called democracy, right? They chose Hamas, so until there is another election, there isn't much anyone can do about it- unless a foreign state actively tries to overthrow Hamas. The past three years of starving the Gaza strip has not caused the Palestinians to re-evaluate their alliance to their government- in fact- it has confirmed to many Palestinians what Hamas has been saying. I doubt if an election were held in the next 6 months, I don't think they would throw Hamas out. I think we need a new strategy.
I also would like to point out, Israel has no one to blame Hamas but themselves. Maybe if they hadn't assasinated the leadership of every movement for Palestinian independence in the past 60 years, they might have more options. The only people left are those who see political power as a way to line their pockets and the religious extremists who don't care how much destruction they cause or is done to them because they are doing God's work. (Not just Israel, I would say most Middle Eastern countries have this problem). Yes, these movements weren't pro-Israel, but I'm sure Israel would rather work with an arab nationalist left wing, secular Palestinian leadership than Islamist movements.
You state "that the Israelis probably did fire first." What are you a complete ignoramus and a dork??
Haven't you seen any of the video footage of the boarding of the ship??
From the microsecond that the first Israeli commando's feet hit the deck he was attacked. And then the second, third, etc.
For you it is probably an orgasmic experience spouting your uninformed venom against anything Israeli...
But then again even if you had seen the video evidence, for you it would have been enough to announce that the video evidence was "doctored", "fabricated", "produced by the zionists" or some other second wave orgasmic utterance.....
Getting caught up in the ecstasy of the moment and blurting out anything could possibly excuse your folly but you should try some other way of getting your rocks off......
Humantarianaid is not violation or hostillty to many people
Not drop of territorial waters was violated.
Had there only been an actual blockade in place, it could've been enforced by Israel. and it may have made the legal justification for the same part of what was done by your military.
For the Israel to claim that there was / is a blockade, the blockade must meet several targets set by law. If Israel even knew of the requirements set by International Law, and for once wanted to apply by the law and tried to meet the requirements of the law the effort was an absolutely total failure.
Two states in war, is needed, if you want to be able to apply the "San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea, 12 June 1994" and thereby make it possible to have a legal and enforceable blockade.
San Remo Manual: SECTION II : METHODS OF WARFARE ;Blockade
These are just a few of the requirements you have failed to meet:
93. A blockade shall be declared and notified to all belligerents and neutral States.
94. The declaration shall specify the commencement, duration, location, and extent of the blockade and the period within which vessels of neutral States may leave the blockaded coastline.
101. The cessation, temporary lifting, re-establishment, extension or other alteration of a blockade must be declared and notified as in paragraphs 93 and 94.
103. If the civilian population of the blockaded territory is inadequately provided with food and other objects essential for its survival, the blockading party must provide for free passage of such foodstuffs and other essential supplies.
in addition to this:
Hamas is not a state
After its 2005 "withdrawal" from Gaza, Israel claims no longer to be an occupier.
On the 18th of January 2009 there was signed unilateral ceasefire agreements by both parties.
There is also at present a cease-fire on Gaza
One state and no war, that makes even the idea of a blockade; nonextensile.
Using Israel's logic and Law;
Any nation is free invoke a blockade at the time and on a state of their chosing,
A state could by choice, maintain a maritime blockade unendingly
To have a war is required, to meet this requirement, it is only required that one state choose to consider itself as being in a war, to have the needed state of war.
The absence of a legal blockade has a ripple effect, making the boarding in international water an actual invasion of state territory and making what you claim to be murder in defenseless, a direct and unprovoked attack on unarmed civilians and executing 9 of them.
The mission was in all it's nature, only added a twist of common sense, pure humanitarian aid. The sencible twist is of course to make you see the blockade as it is, and in the way it is seen world wide: ( excl. US and Israel of course)
All 'n Alll ILLEGAL.
PEOPLE NEED TO GIVE ISRAEL A BREAK !!!
ISRAEL IS ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE EQUATION ....they are an established democracy and a UN registered state, (and btw they also want the 2 state solution) but palestine has elected people that send rockets into a free country on a daily basis , for the past couple of days that has been happening and then everyone blames IDF when it retaliates.... even in hama's official charter it says explicitly (kill all jews, we will wipe out israel from face of planet , etc , now that means that IDF is in a perpetual state of war, and war has causalities ...
also this could be a covert turkish operation ..... paving way for the turkish AKP to gain support in the arab street as they are facing huge pressures domestically for tryin to tame the army ! this might be one the ways to divert attention of the turkish republic from the immensely embroiling ERGENKON CASE which the islamist AKP is tryin to overthrow all the secular military leaders in jail by usuing media as power and forever makin turkey into a islamist version that they want it to be .... remember GAZA is a ploy for ERDOGAN , he used it in DAVOS to get overall arab support and now tryin to show it again !! .....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6jDIQr59Sk&feature=player_embedded
pls listen carefully to the man in this video
he CLEARLY SAYS ISRAEL WILL ALLOW ALL HUMANITARIAN AID AND UNDER THE RELIEF WORKERS OBSERVATION !! NOW IT WAS THEIR FAULT NOT TO LISTEN .... OBVIOUSLY IF SOMEONE IS TRYING TO ENTER YOUR COUNTRY ILLEGALLY THEN YOU WOULD STOP THEM TOO ....
THIS IS ALL A PLOY BY THE AKP , to get credibility in the arab street, and to take pressure of them at home for their complete wrong doings to their military leaders !!
what would the western nations or for that matter any nation have done if illegal ships were being docked on your coastline .....exactly ....stop them and if they dont heed capture them !!
Good god man, how ignorant of human decency do you have to be to condone murder of these civilians.
ISRAEL's military committed murder in International waters. Zionism has demonized anything and everything Palestinian that even basic aid is considered illegal. Their soldiers acted like they did in Gaza in 2009 and killed over 600 civilians, most of them children. The Israel army does not consider these people as humans and their first instinct is to kill them thinking no one in the world cares since the pro israel lobbies will protect them and cover up the massacres. NOT THIS TIME.
Jews around the world are feeling the pains of this murder. Nothing will justify it no matter how hard you try to shield it with your crap about what Turkey was really up to. After decades of protecting and siding with Israel, Turkey is now waking up after its own citizens paid the price of this unholy friendship.
An expected response from the wily Hindoo Indian
An expected response from the wily Hindoo Indian defending a beast that is Israel.
And why does the Hindoo come to the aid of the Beast of Israel because both Israel and India have a common motive to destablise Pakistan.
Nixon was right about the over-aggressive Hindoos and Jews. "The Pakistanis are straightforward and sometimes extremely stupid. The Indians are more devious, sometimes so smart that we fall for their line; the Indians are bastards anyway” in the run-up to the Indian invasion of East Pakistan in 1971.
See more here: http://lalqila.wordpress.com/2010/05/29/nixon-called-indira-gandhi-an-old-witchthe-indians-are-bastards-anyway-help-india-push-the-pakistanis-outi-dont-want-him-to-come-in-with-that-kind-of-jackass-thing-with-me-keatin/
And the reason Jews love the Hindoos "Hindus whose hearts have been full of hatred towards the Muslims, therefore, India is the most important base for us to work there from, against Pakistan. It is essential that we exploit this base and strike and crush Pakistanis, by all disguised and secret plans" David Ben Gurion, August 9, 1967
See more here: http://lalqila.wordpress.com/2010/05/29/the-day-pakistan-and-israel-came-close-to-war/
As a S. Indian I experienced no less in S. Africa. Israel is not innocent because Palestine does not belong to Israel. Israel is occupying Palestine illegally. The bile you spew that mindless zombies like u, makes it even worse. As an Indian you should be ashamed to call your self such because it appears that u little or nothing about the suffering of the Indians
under the thugish rule. I was not born in India, but I am old enough to know what suppression does to a peoples. Do you remember Amritsa?
It is clear that B.A. and Lal demand rights for Palestinians that they deny for Israelis - self determination. There would be no conflict today if the Hamas, Hezbollah and the majority of Arab states recognized what the international community has in 1948, the rights of the Jewish sovereign State of Israel.
Indian is right on. Israel is only the canary in the coal mine.
they are an established democracy
You are free to make that claim but the fact is we are not talking about anything but international waters and there they should be required to follow the laws that civilized people have created. Remember the USS Liberty and the 34 sailors murdered by thugs in armed boats.
Legally - Israel has rights to all of Palestine
Let's be clear Varsi. It's important to know your facts. In 1922 the League of Nations, in a unanimous vote, mandated a Jewish Homeland in Palestine. The UN Partition Plan of 1947 which would have given Judea and Samaria to the Arabs of Palestine was accepted by the Jewish people and rejected by the Arabs. Now as then, the problem is not the acceptance of an another (23) Arab states, but the Arab acceptance of one (1) Jewish state.
If the Palestinians want claim to that land, let them come to the peace table and negotiate for it as nations do.
You're an idiot with selective "outrage". The U.S. (excluding Obamatrons like you) has ONE ally in the Islamic sea aka the Middle East - Israel.
Clear thinking people understand the BIG picture, Hamas and Hizballah (are you a member?) are trying to ELIMINATE Israel.
People like me WON'T let that happen
I wonder what would have been the reaction of the European governments if a flotilla had violated their territorial waters, despite early warnings that any such attempts would be considered as a hostile action.
If the mission had really been humanitarian in nature, there would have been an innumerable number of other ways to dispatch the aid.
Of course the Western media assumes that Israeli commandos fired first without provocation, since they're inherently evil and irrational.
Gaza is NOT zionist territory. The Gazan coast is NOT Zionist territory. Gazan waters are NOT Zionist territory.
HECK, SO-CALLED ZIONIST TERRITORY ISN'T EVEN ZIONIST TERRITORY! The propaganda control of the US people, and the political subversion of the US govt that has protected and facilitated the long years of Zionist criminality is coming to an end. I'm an American and a Jew, and I hope I live to see payback and the end of Zionist criminality. The Jews are stubborn. Five thousand years stubborn. Mostly they're VERY smart, but somethings they never learn.
It's getting harder and harder to justify murder isn't it.
I'm not going to discount the possibility of the passengers being armed, but I have to wonder why the Israeli's sent to the ship were armed with live ammunition (at the least there's nothing so far to suggest that rubber bullets or water hoses were used). Regardless Israel seems to have politically lost this round, especially as I have trouble accepting allegations of links to Al Qaeda.
It's the USS Liberty all over again
I like the way Blake Hounsell frames the attack as a 'public relations disaster' for Israel rather than what it actually was: naked aggression reminiscent of Israel's killing of 34 American sailors in the same waters on board the USS Liberty back in 1967. Israel's got form here.
As with the Liberty I imagine we'll shortly see all sorts of cover ups and conniving to avoid Israel being unduly embarrassed by further 'public relations disasters'.
The crew members of the USS LIberty watched and were relieved when the jets passed and identified the USS LIberty. Even the IDF admited that they had identified the ship the day before but somehow claimed that in a war zone they failed to keep tack of the fact that a US navy ship was in the area.
The only ship attacked outside of a port was the USS Liberty. THey used napalm to make sure the crew was dead when they had all the intention of sinking the US Navy and then making the claim that it was sunk by Egypt.
Remember our dead sailors of the USS Liberty forgotten and left to die by the USA government.
Where is the USS Liberty today (gone to the scrap yard, probably)? Would have been interesting to have had the Liberty as an escort vessel. Would have been interesting to paint "USS LIBERTY" in BIG letters on the side of the aid ships. Would have been interesting to have sailed WEST from Cyprus and then south to the African coast. and then sailed along just inside Egyptian territorial waters until the Egyptian navy came out to "intercept", and then used the Egyptian navy as a sort of escort. Should the Israels have attempted to interfere, the "flotilla" could have gone right full rudder and taken "refuge" in Egyptian waters. If not taken into custody by the Egyptians, the flotilla could then have sailed all the way to Gaza under Egyptian "protection". Yeah, I know, that didn't happen. And yeah, I know, it probably wouldn't have worked out that way even if the aid people had tried that plan. But if you ask me, I'd say there is an astonishing lack of creativity out there by people who, forswearing violence, seem badly in need of some kid of "Plan B".
Blake Houneshell - get with the program pal
After taking a swipe at the Palestinains, " The one thing that might extrictate Israel from this mess is a violent response from the Palestinian side -- which never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity." You claim - gee- not sure what happened?
Turn on your YOUTUBE pal, it's all over it.
Israel made the very grave mistake of murdering people aboard a Turkish ship in international waters.
http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/
http://www.middle-east-online.com/english/?id=39276
http://www.maannews.net/eng/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=288349
UPDATE VI: Israeli Channel 2 reports 20 murdered via Dimi Reider
UPDATE V: New Hasbara effort to blame victims for their murder. IDF claims activists attempted to wrestle IDF arms away from soldiers. I urge every journalist who reports this story to remember the history of lies for which the IDF is known in such embarrassing situations. This report is NOT verified or authenticated and should not be treated as such.
UPDATE IV: Bitter historical irony–remember the Holocaust survivors who ran the British blockade of Palestine in order to reach freedom? What has Israel done? What has it become? H/t Dan Sieradski
UPDATE III: Maariv reports IDF threatened use of live fire against Gaza flotilla before ships departed:
“We have a very great fear of acts of terror being perpetrated from these ships. We have no idea whether terrorists may’ve boarded these boats,” explained a senior officer. “We wish to avoid the use of force, but at the moment there is a danger to life for our troops, we will use live fire.”
In the language of the IDF, this was not a threat, this was a promise.
UPDATE II: The Hasbara apparatus is in full throttle. Maariv reports that foreign news sources (which it conveniently does not name) report that IDF soldiers were fired on by those within the ship. Others report 2 IDF soldiers lightly wounded. Israeli Army Radio reports IDF was confronted by attackers “with sharp objects.” This is true desperation. Blame the victims for their own murder.
UPDATE I: Haaretz reports via Turkish media that 10 have been killed. Dozens storm Israeli consulate in Istanbul in protest.
UPDATE: The BBC is reporting that the first group of six ships was intercepted by the Israeli navy 90 miles off the Gaza coast in international waters. This is certainly a violation of maritime laws as Israel has absolutely no right nor justification for such intervention. Israel itself had lengthened its claim to 68 miles offshore. The Twitter feed reports killed and wounded in the IDF attack. Haaretz reports that two have been killed (or I should say murdered since these were unarmed civilians and the IDF knew this). I have viewed a Turkish video feed which appears to show at least one dead boy on board. Let us add this to the list of Israeli crimes against international law. Other reports note that the ship attacks was Turkish, thus adding to the severity of the incident. Does Israel think that Turkey will take this lying down? And by the way, for those pro-Israel types who wish to claim Gaza is NOT occupied, this intervention gives the lie to this.
Israel's mistake is that it didn't shoot at the shipsd like any
other country would have done, what do yo think the U.S would do. The soldiers were carrying paintball guns and handguns, they were attacked with metal poles knives handguns and bats, what kind of an organized humanatarian group comes prepared with knives. The fault lays on the people who organized this cruise in order to create a altercation well ya got one, happy now???????? they could have dropped off the supplies at Israel and it would have made it's way to Gaza but they chose altercation, the Israeli soldiers only responded when they were being lynched by the people on the ship and there was danger to their lives, what would the U.S or Russian soldiers do if someone was shooting at them. When they tried to do this to Egypt they were shot at and left llike good little kids they only try to delegitemize Israel. The Blood of these people lays on the hands Ardugan amongst the other terror supporters on the ships.
The world media is bias and hypocritical against ISrael and Europe is sucking on the propoganda tit.
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